#Ed Sheeran Takes the Stand in ‘Thinking Out Loud’ Copyright Case

Ed Sheeran took the stand in a New York federal courtroom on Tuesday to defend himself in a copyright infringement case that alleges his 2014 hit “Thinking Out Loud” rips off the 1973 Marvin Gaye classic “Let’s Get it On.”

The “Shape of You” singer, 32, along with Sony and others, was sued in 2017 by the heirs of the late songwriter Ed Townsend, who wrote the soul hit that was later recorded by Gaye. Kathryn Griffin Townsend, his daughter and only living direct heir, is the plaintiff leading the civil trial.

During questioning from the plaintiff’s legal team, Sheeran argued that many pop songs share similar chord progressions, and said that his decision to do a mash-up of “Thinking Out Loud” and “Let’s Get it On” at a 2014 concert was not the “smoking gun” that Kathryn’s attorney Ben Crump claimed it was.

“If I’d done what you’re accusing me of doing, I’d be an idiot to stand on stage in front of 20,000 people and do that,” the musician said. “It is my belief that most pop songs are built on building blocks that have been freely available for hundreds of years.”

To prove his point, Sheeran — who claimed that he often mashes together songs with similar chords at his concerts — pinpointed a number of other popular songs that share the same progressions, including Van Morrison’s “Crazy Love” and “Someone You Loved” by Lewis Capaldi.

The pop star grew visibly frustrated multiple times on the stand, including when Kathryn’s legal team shared lyrics from his song “Take It Back” that included a reference to plagiarism, but did not allow Sheeran to explain the context of the lyrics.

“I feel like you don’t want me to answer because what I’m going to say is going to make quite a lot of sense,” Sheeran said.

Elsewhere, Sheeran revealed that he first heard “Let’s Get it On” in Austin Powers: The Spy Who Shagged Me as a child, and also explained that “Thinking Out Loud” came from an emotional conversation he had with co-writer Amy Wadge about the love his grandparents shared.

The singer said he did not know if Wadge — who will testify later in the trial — was familiar with Townsend’s song because he and Wadge no longer speak about “Thinking Out Loud.”

“To be honest, all this stuff has put me off [talking about and listening to ‘Thinking Out Loud’],” said Sheeran, who was in good spirits as he spent the day’s lunch break eating a meatball sub in the courthouse cafeteria.

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Prior to opening statements, Judge Louis L. Stanton explained to the jury that certain elements within compositions can be unprotected by copyright law, including phrases of speech, key, meter, tempo and chord progressions.

In his statement, Crump said the trial is “about giving credit where credit is due,” and called the mash-up video “a voluntary confession” from Sheeran that he’d stolen the track.

Meanwhile, in her own opening statement, Sheeran’s attorney Ilene Farkas said it’s “exceedingly common” to hear frequently used chord progressions in popular songs, and that they’re “so basic” that no one can claim ownership of them.

“All songwriters draw from this basic musical toolkit,” Farkas said.

Kathryn also took the stand to share witness testimony. She entered the courtroom in a pale pink jacket that read “integrity” on the back in black letters, though she later changed into a black jacket before speaking to the jury.

“It was never my intention going into this to be sitting in this courtroom,” she said. “This is not about wanting something for nothing or being referred to, as some heirs are, as a copyright troll… I promised my father that I would protect my father’s intellectual properties as he did.”

She added that she felt as though the legacy of her father Townsend “is being treated like trash,” and that her only goal is to keep her father’s legacy alive.

“I respect Mr. Sheeran for his wonderful, talented gifts god gave him to share with the world,” she said. “I think Mr. Sheeran is a great artist with a great future. Mr. Sheeran, I want you to know I didn’t want to come to this, but I have to protect my father’s legacy.”

The trial will continue on Wednesday, with Sheeran expected to testify later in the week.

The star previously faced a similar plagiarism suit over his song “Shape of You,” for which he was accused of stealing the hook. He ultimately won that case in April 2022, with a judge saying he “neither deliberately nor subconsciously copied” a different song, the writers of which had sued him.

Sheeran was awarded $1.1 million after the high-profile trial, and later warned of the ripple effects the case could have on the songwriting industry.

“I feel like claims like this are way too common now, and have become a culture where a claim is made with the idea that a settlement will be cheaper than taking it to court, even if there’s no base for a claim,” he said in an Instagram video. “It’s really damaging to the songwriting industry. There’s only so many notes and very few chords used in pop music. Coincidence is bound to happen if 60,000 songs are being released every day on Spotify.”